Mandeville, LA – Exclusive Transcript – The states that ratified or in the future would ratify the Constitution would ratify it under the understanding that they are sovereign entities and they are entering into a compact, meaning that if they do not delegate an authority to be exercised on their behalf by the new general government, then they have reserved that power. The states did delegate the authority to prosecute treasons against the general government but reserved the power to prosecute their own treasons. Check out today’s transcript for the rest…
Begin Mike Church Show Transcript
Mike: Scott is in Indiana. How you doing?
Caller Scott: Not too bad, sir. Thank you for taking my phone call. I have a curious question for you about treason.
Mike: Ooh, the big T.
Caller Scott: The question is, could a state like Texas or New York, could they prosecute for treason or is that specifically referred to a group of states?
Mike: That is a really, really good question. I’m glad you asked that. Before I get into a scholarly-like answer, what do you think?
Caller Scott: I would think it would be reserved to the state individually, that or as a conglomerate like states, either or.
Mike: So you think the treason power would be reserved to the states?
Caller Scott: Yes, sir.
Mike: Could the State of Indiana, for example, could it file a charge of treason, say against Steven Miller, the acting head of the IRS — is that what you’re asking?
Caller Scott: Well, that’s a possibility.
Mike: You can’t hold treason against a government, because a government is not capable of treason. Those working inside of or for a government are. That’s a charge that would be leveled against an individual.
Caller Scott: Yes.
Mike: Then you have to ask a specific question. Let’s just pretend that you’re asking it about Steven Miller. The answer to the question is — let me give you a Clintonian answer: [mocking] “That depends on what your definition of is is.” In all seriousness, the treason clause in the Constitution says something to the effect, and I don’t have my handy dandy pocket Constitution with me, but it says something to the effect of making war or levying war against Them. Who are the Them?
Caller Scott: That’s my question. This is the interesting aspect. In the Constitution it says “We the people,” so if you declare war against a person —
Mike: Original article, original sin number one, the preamble to the Constitution means absolutely nothing. Forget it. It doesn’t even exist. Go to Article I, Section I. It doesn’t say “we the people.” It doesn’t say anything. It says “All legislative Powers herein granted shall be vested in a Congress.” Those are the first words.
Caller Scott: Right. The other question I have, too, which is kind of strange —
Mike: No, no, let’s stick with the treason question. I was actually reading, in my historical research, a case just the other day when I was going through the essays and doing a little bit of research on John Marshall’s McCulloch v. Maryland case, about how taxation got out of control to start with, which is what we’re talking about with the IRS abuse today. I actually stumbled upon some writings by Judge Spencer Roane where he was citing — I didn’t look it up but I will — that there was a case in the State of Virginia where Virginia was seeking a treason conviction against a citizen of Virginia. Outside of the U.S. Constitution, this is where most of your “conservatives” get off the reservation and have no clue about what they’re actual heritage is.
The states that ratified or in the future would ratify the Constitution would ratify it under the understanding that they are sovereign entities and they are entering into a compact, meaning that if they do not delegate an authority to be exercised on their behalf by the new general government, then they have reserved that power. The states did delegate the authority to prosecute treasons against the general government but reserved the power to prosecute their own treasons, meaning the Indiana legislature, if you still have it on the books, could absolutely prosecute someone for treason against the State of Indiana. Let me give you a very recent example.
Let’s say, for example, that the Tsarnaev boys were actual natural born and bred citizens of the State of Taxachusetts. Let’s say that the purpose of their bombing of the Boston Marathon on Patriot’s Day was not just to maim and create terrorism, but it was to undermine and begin the process of overthrowing the republican form of government in Massachusetts. The State of Massachusetts would be full well within their own rights as a sovereign entity to prosecute them for treason against the Commonwealth of Massachusetts.
To answer your question, yes. In Indiana, yes, but you would have to have a case to be made that whoever it is that you want to prosecute for treason is actually committing treason against your state. Now, the guy at the IRS is not committing treason against the United States. Eric Holder, I do not believe is committing treason. I don’t think President Obama is. He’s not making or levying war against them. You may disagree with their actions and you may not like them, but I do not believe that the case for treason exists. There is a case to be made for treason to be prosecuted and, if you wanted to, to be very robustly explored inside any state that’s a member of the Union, even a state that’s not a member of the Union. Say you dropped out. You would certainly have the power to prosecute treason.
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Caller Scott: Thank you very much. You hit the nail on the head, so to speak. That was my only question.
Mike: They tell me sometimes that I do that.
Caller Scott: You do it very well.
Mike: Will you be willing to take a brief customer survey at the end of this phone call?
Caller Scott: Yeah, if you want me to I can.
Mike: I’m kidding. All right, thank you very much. I guarantee you a bunch of people’s heads are spinning right now.
End Mike Church Show Transcript